Support the way it should not be done – The chat history
The customer wanted to ask Gigabyte via feature request to show the HII interface of the corresponding expansion cards again, so that they can be configured comfortably and without problems directly in the UEFI. I spare you the upload lists of attachments here, they are available to me as PDF. Furthermore I am fair enough not to mention any names and to shorten the quotes to the essentials.
| I have a Broadcom p225p installed in this motherboard. But the motherboard only shows PCle ROM Options for the integrated Intel controller, not for other cards. 1 waited for a support request because in my Aorus Master x299x this came with the latest BIOS version, so i was able to control the features of my RAID cards/ Network cards.On the x670 Aorus master this important feature is missing/ or expansion rom options for other cards are filtered out. So i have this feature request to be able to configure my network card while im in the UEFI. Some settings cannot be altered while in the OS.These option ROM Settings should always be visible. lf not, these PCle expansion cards cannot be used to their full potential. Same Expansion cards even allow for Firmware upgrades while in UEFI, like my Emulex OCE14xxx in my x299x. This is extremely useful. |
After the initial message this came as an answer in German:
|
The card needs a 8ter port, but you have only a 4er and 2er free. Therefore this Dual LAN card cannot run.
|
What a nonsense. It will run, maybe a bit slower, but it can. The counter test on a competitor product proved that later. The PCIe specifications allow for such a fallback.
| The card also works with fewer lanes. Since only one port of the card is used, the bandwidth is completely sufficient and that is not the problem! The problem is that the BIOS/ UEFI does not show the expansion ROM options of the network cards or RAID controllers. Only for the onboard network card from Intel a menu is shown, as long as one has not deactivated it. This was better on the Aorus Master X299X, as already described, with the last UEFI versions. I was finally able to configure my RAID controller and network cards myself in UEFI. And yes, CSM is disabled.to configure such expansion cards correctly, these menus must be available. Otherwise I can’t use advanced features of these cards. Also switching to Legacy Boot doesn’t help, because some options don’t work there. These ROM extensions should normally be found under Advanced > 1/0 Options. There is in any case something for the onboard Intel card… |
I don’t have to (and don’t want to) comment on the following answer
| We would like to have the written confirmation from the manufacturer of the Dual LAN card, that this card can work error free on a xl or x4 port, contrary to its technical specification |
This is cheese. The opposite would be proven even on an in-house X299 board. According to the PCI SIG, the expansion cards and the motherboard can adjust the number of lanes or the data transfer rate if needed. PCIe slots can support different numbers of lanes (e.g. x1, x4, x8, x16). PCIe is backward compatible, which means that modern hardware and operating systems can automatically adjust the PCIe configuration. Some systems can even reduce the number of active lanes to save power when full bandwidth is not needed. But well, new start:
| The card runs fine in a x4 slot! You just don’t get the maximum bandwidth when using both ports. Since when does PCle have such a limitation of lanes? Gezappel gibts there maybe with ancient motherboards with PCle 1.xlst there someone competent who understands what I want from him, instead of wanting to pull out a tree somewhere else? |
Ok, the answer came promptly:
| According to the technical documentation of the card requires 8 lanes … If you have another written statement from the manufacturer, please send us the original (PDF). Our lab will gladly check if something can be done to support you. |
The customer remains (still) quite calm and answers
| So again, calmly: The card works. Like every server network card, even in a slower and also smaller slot. Why? Because these NICs can be sold/built with only one port and these NICs are flexible accordingly. It is logical that Broadcom writes this as a minimum requirement, because otherwise both 25GbE SFP28 ports cannot be operated with full performance, since we can transfer here bidirectionally up to l0OGbE. That in addition. The next thing is, that MY REQUEST HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT! The card works fine. At work also temporarily in a PCle2 slot … |
Now comes apparently again the colleague from the HQ to use, translated and recopied.
| Could the customer provide the appropriate BIOS settings for the NIC on the X299X Aorus Master? Does the NIC work in UEFI/legacy mode? If the NIC is working in legacy mode, ask the customer to set Other PCI Device ROM Priority to Legacy only and (enable SM support in the bios). Please have the customer set the BIOS settings and update to BIOS version Fl3c…. Before and after BIOS update load BIOS once Default and reboot. Download BIOS file / unzip and copy to FAT 32 formatted USB stick. Go to BIOS and load it at Save & Exit Default (default settings). Exit with Fl0 and call BIOS again. Press F8 in the BIOS. Perform the BIOS update from the USB stick. (SM support disabled Decoding over 4G enabled Onboard LAN controller disabled. Please have the customer update the latest NIC drivers and firmware. P225P – 2 x 25/l0G PCle-NIC (broadcom.com) |
The annoying thing about such feedback is always when you realize that the other person didn’t understand the problem at all. So once again from the beginning the whole thing:
| I have just tested the BIOS. Unfortunately, the menu is not displayed. (CSM off, 4G on, Onboard LAN off) CSM has to be off either way for this menu to show up at all, at least that’s my experience. I’m not sure if the P225P can do a legacy mode, but PXE and other boot options are disabled on the P225P, so there are no corresponding messages from a ROM, so there is no boot device available. I’ve included sample pictures of my x299x and also pictures of the F13C and the F13C under Windows. |
After all the explanations comes the advice to use the legacy mode, although exactly that is proven to be useless and counterproductive. Not to mention the security aspect.
|
If CSM is off, the query runs in UEFI mode, if CSM is on, then in Legavy mode. Test it with CSM on. If necessary, ask the manufacturer of the card, which mode the ROM of the card supports.
|
By the way, the customer remained surprisingly calm and tried to explain again:
| …As already said, PXE boot is disabled on the card and thus no boot menu is visible in legacy mode. It only makes sense to run the card in EFI mode. With the X299X this is also set so, because I run because of the activation of the large address spaces otherwise in a black screen when booting. So CSM is always off for me, the settings for this are identical for the x670e and the x299x. If everything else is correct with the UEFI, the network card should be able to show its configuration menu in the UEFI. By the way, this only worked on the x299x in UEFI with an LSI 9361 Bi, which was sold some months ago. There this was especially critical, because as soon as you switch the controller to legacy mode to configure it with the x670e, the support for large address spaces is automatically disabled by the controller. What means that the performance suffers strongly, since one cannot switch this back in the controller, as long as this is started in the Legacy mode/ with CSM and one cannot configure it around UEFI directly again correctly. I was positively surprised with the last BIOS versions of the x299x, when you could finally manage the controller and RAID volumes in UEFI itself… |
And the reaction to this? Here the support staff copied some correspondence and pasted it without reformulating it
| We used two Lan PCIE adapters and both can be recognized in the BIOS. Both cards also work fine under the operating system. Did the customer try to connect the Lan adapter to the PCIEx16 slot? Did it work? We have checked this with our responsible team. There is nothing the BIOS can do. It depends on the design of each Lan PCIE adapter. We just follow the AMD AGESA rule and update the BIOS. I would suggest that the customer contact AMD and the Lan card manufacturer for detailed information. |
Did they really ever test non-Intel cards? The customer of course wrote back after going through the hassle that should really be handled by support.
| Since the attached pictures confirmed rather than disproved my theory, I sat down and counter-tested 7 more expansion cards. I took apart 3 PCs for this and rummaged through my collection of cards and countertested them with the X299X, so a small effort. But I’m really interested now … i upload once the great pictures. The cards were each countertested in the X299X, then all successively in the x670e. Maybe you notice something, but the Avago/ Broadcom SAS controller is an exception in my theory. Except for once, I only took a picture of the x670e PC’s monitor output when the card reported positive. I hope you guys trust me on this. |
What is interesting – for the cards always the same slots were used and as already written: the Intel cards ran yes and exactly the same configuration. There one can doubt already somewhat with the now following answer:
| These two cards on the PCleX2 and PCleX4 each individually, the system does not start? No disks may hang at the SATA port 4 and 5. |
Aha. So it was necessary to answer once more and to go longer (shortened):
| … I have, as already mentioned, once a pool of expansion cards from my collection / my PCs scraped together and tested in the X299X [environment] against. I only took cards whose HII interface was shown in the UEFI on the X299X. I then counter tested these cards in the X670E. And it confirms my theory. One exception: The Avago SAS controller 9271 is also shown. Either the board hadn’t done it with my 9361 earlier this year, or I’m misremembering, as this controller was then replaced with two NVMe SSDs anyway.
And the boards all work otherwise. That’s not the issue. What doesn’t work is the HII fading in, depending on the card. And the UEFI seems to favor Intel here with one exception, the SAS controller. The image 2NNiceChoice [see page 1] contains all the cards tested … I always used the same PCle slot. So the one that is connected with x4. So now I can say pretty sure that the fade in of the HII interface is very selective. |
The answer was as short as the time until it came:
| Since we did not have this effect, see oh there is an idea or explanation from the respective manufacturer about this. |
Slowly, the adrenaline level rises…
| So again: The Intel cards are faded in nevertheless problem-free, exactly like with you, with the x670e per HII? Only Broadcom/ EMU LEX not. And probably still other manufacturers not, if I had then more appropriate cards. I have a good collection of expansion cards, but I earn only limited money and have limited space. And not all of them support EFI/ the Hll interface. And that’s not because of the cards directly, but because of the UEFI. Otherwise it wouldn’t work on my server systems at work or on the x299x. Why? Maybe AMI or AMD can tell you. But I don’t need to ask them, I’m not their customer, but yours. The cards work fine on the x670e/ except for the missing HII and are recognized cleanly. And I don’t need to ask anyone about the Emulex cards. The manufacturer is Broadcom, Emulex was bought up and killed off. They don’t exist anymore. And the 9271 is also older than my mother. Broadcom won’t even talk to me. It was already unsuccessful to get a question answered regarding an incomplete manual. Until they changed the manual on their website.
Here it goes in a function of the UEFI! You hide the extensions of the ROM options. I link here times an example, so that perhaps finally arrives, on which I want to go out. You hide this menu! It does not work with other cards either. My Emulex OCE144xxxx, my Intel X710 T2L etc, all hidden. Only the option ROM of the onboard Intel i225 is hidden. I would have liked to make a feature request that you make these menus available, as ch in the last UEFI versions of the Aorus Master X299X, so that I and OTHERS can fully utilize their expansion cards. This was my last attempt… |
Once again I took a breath, then the answer came at some point
| Even we can’t change anything, the Intel cards are running, so it is guaranteed that the ports / the port is running and also the Bios is doing the detection correctly. See if there are any firmware updates for the older cards. |
That the customer gives up after so many mails then unnerved, is only too understandable. But there is at least a very simple solution, which we will see on the next page. However, Gigabyte has nothing to gain from this.
293 Antworten
Kommentar
Lade neue Kommentare
Neuling
Veteran
Urgestein
Urgestein
Urgestein
Urgestein
1
1
Urgestein
1
Urgestein
Urgestein
Urgestein
Urgestein
Urgestein
Veteran
Neuling
Urgestein
Urgestein
Alle Kommentare lesen unter igor´sLAB Community →